(meteorobs) The Disintegrating Meteor

Swift, Wesley Wesley.R.Swift at msfc.nasa.gov
Wed Mar 9 18:40:30 EST 2005


George,


George>> when I accidentally bump my 10" while looking thru the  eyepiece,
I'd see something looking rather similar

	A 10" SCT is a rather massive device and standard mounts damp out
mirror flop very quickly.  If it was bumped as you suggest then it should
have been reported.  What you see when a scope is bumped is all the stars
dancing in parallel over the whole field.  The mountain ridge, although
faint, would probably be invisable if there were that much camera motion.

George>> If I look closely at the image in the "train" area, I see what
could be 3 or 4 stars burned in its midst.

	The "worms" in the trail do not parallel the trail as they would if
the effect were from camera motion.  And why is the rest of the image above
the mountain star free?  A single meteor, debris or landing light perhaps,
but stars come in bunches all over the image and move in parallel.  The
closer I look the more certain I am that camera motion is not part of the
answer.

George>> If this was a meteor, it would indicate to me that it was quite far
away...maybe 150 miles?

	Agreed.  This would tend to make the trail detail unresolvable,
particularly for a meteor comming from the east since the trail would be
even further.

George>> I'm beginning to  lean towards the object being an airplane that
switched on its landing lights momentarily. 

	Well, at that plate scale a moonlit contrail could look very much
like what is in the image..

George>> A possibility, but my money is more on the airplane theory at the
moment.

	Looking good to me as well.  

Wes

============================================
        Wesley R. Swift, Jr
     Raytheon ITSS / Sverdrup MSFC Group
     Marshall Space Flight Center
     EV13, Bldg 4487, room C-151a
     Huntsville, Al 35812
     (256) 544-1392 Fax 544-0242
 
       Home:
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-----Original Message-----
From: meteorobs-bounces at meteorobs.org
[mailto:meteorobs-bounces at meteorobs.org] On Behalf Of GeoZay at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2005 4:09 PM
To: meteorobs at meteorobs.org
Subject: Re: (meteorobs) The Disintegrating Meteor

 

Wes>>   I am somewhat concerned by the number of  meteor "old hands" 
Wes>> that
seem to find this interesting image an occasion to  cry "Liar liar, Pants on
fire" rather than to use their imagination.   For myself, I prefer to
believe
that Geir is accurate in his observation  documentation and find it an
interesting puzzle. <<
 
Well...if it gets past the "old hands", then I'd say he had something.  :O)


Wes>>Any photographer with five  minutes experience with any SLR on 
Wes>>tripod
fired remotely KNOWS that mirror  flop is an extremely small effect: nowhere
near the size of the streak in the  image. <<
 
I'd agree with you if we are talking about having a 50mm or 35mm lens
on...but I think we are talking about a 10" telescope? I'd have to go back
and  look to see what the actual size is, but I think it was stated that it
was a  10"? 
Anyhow, when I accidentally bump my 10" while looking thru the  eyepiece,
I'd see something looking rather similar...if I used my imagination  just a
tiny bit. :O)
 
 Wes>> Furthermore, anyone with
handheld star images knows  that the effect is more like "worms" than "cigar
and  smoke".  <<
 
You know, a bright something can be "burned" into the film and afterwards
bump the telescope before the shutter closed and you will come out with
something similar in the photograph. The meteor/airplane or what have you
has already burned it's image in. What happens afterwards won't effect the
meteor  like image after it is gone. A bright star can then jiggle around
burning it's  own image in the film. If I look closely at the image in the
"train" area, I see what could be 3 or 4 stars burned in its midst.
 

Wes>> Since he was setting up for lunar  photography (hence the plate
scale) he must have been aimed E by NE at about  15 degrees elevation (the
moon at the specified time was up 10.72deg, Az  105.9deg).<<
 
I just realized this object was low in the sky near the horizon. This
brings in a couple more things to think about. If this was a meteor, it
would indicate to me that it was quite far away...maybe 150 miles? At least
quite a  bit further than if it occured closer to the zenith. That train
sure looks  mighty spread out and focused for that distance. I'd expect any
train to be compressed with distinguishing detail quite depressed.  I'm
beginning to  lean towards the object being an airplane that switched on its
landing lights momentarily. I've seen this happen quite frequently when
aircraft pass over  mountains. 
It use to be a routine sight from my old observatory in the mountains  of
San Diego, Calif. I don't know if it can happen, but maybe if they were
landing lights close to an aircraft, they would also illuminate heat
turbulance  near the plane like a strobe? Of course this would make the
plane a lot closer  than a meteor, because of the lower elevation. Also
makes things easier to photograph in detail. Not all the time will small
aircraft be heard at the  likely distance. The "meteor" image could look
like what I see in the photograph...but you might expect some part of a
plane showing up in the image  as well?
 
Wes>> Reentering
boosters and other rockets usually have residual  volatiles which can
produce a plume and trail.  <<
 
A possibility, but my money is more on the airplane theory at the  moment.
 
>> This still doesn't rule out a grazing meteor from  the
east, but I prefer the space junk idea at the moment. <<
 
If a grazing meteor or space junk...wouldn't both of these be relatively
long distance travelers? With space junk traveling much further than an
earthgrazing meteor. To me, the photograph doesn't seem to fit either of
these possibilities. Bottom line, it still doesn't make any sense for the
photograph  to be that of a meteor and it's train.
George Zay

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